00001 1 2 CITY OF MILWAUKEE 3 LICENSES COMMITTEE 4 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 5 In the Matter of Class B Tavern and Tavern 6 Amusement License Renewal application for "Pop Promotions, LLC" 7 "TEXTURE" 8 SALVATORE SALVO 606 S. 5th Street 9 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 10 COMMITTEE MEMBERS 11 ALD. JAMES BOHL - Chair 12 ALD. MILELE COGGS - Vice Chair ALD. T. ANTHONY ZIELINSKI 13 ALD. ASHANTI HAMILTON ALD. NIK KOVAC 14 15 LICENSING DIVISION by REBECCA GRILL POLICE DEPARTMENT by SERGEANT CHAD REDEN 16 OFFICE OF THE CITY ATTORNEY by ATTORNEY ADAM STEPHENS 17 18 Proceedings had and testimony given in 19 the above-entitled matter, before the LICENSES 20 COMMITTEE OF THE CITY OF MILWAUKEE, on 21 the 7th day of July, 2011. 22 23 * * * * * 00002 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Item is for Salvatore 3 Salvo, Agent for "Pop Promotions, LLC", Class B 4 Tavern and Tavern Amusement License Renewal 5 application for "Texture" at 606 South 5th 6 Street. 7 Before we begin any further here, I'll 8 just turn this over for a brief summation for the 9 committee by Mr. Stephens. 10 MR. STEPHENS: Thank you, Mr. Chair. 11 As the committee - - committee may recall, this 12 matter was heard on, I believe at the last 13 public meeting, on June 21st, 2011. Findings of 14 fact and conclusions of law, the report of the 15 committee was forwarded to the Common Council. 16 The Common Council did not have an opportunity to 17 consider that report, because the license 18 applicant, through - - through counsel, filed a 19 lawsuit in the Milwaukee County Circuit Court, 20 which was heard the day before Council. 21 And the Circuit Court issued a - - an 22 injunction against the Common Council from 23 considering the committee's report, because of 24 what the court believed was a - - a fairness 25 issue, in that the licenses - - Or excuse me - - 00003 1 the license applicant complained, among other 2 things, that an open records violation had 3 occurred. Because prior to the committee 4 hearing, two separate open records request for 5 police reports were issued by the - - the license 6 applicant, and there was a CAD report that the 7 license applicant felt was responsive that was 8 not provided. However, the City maintains that 9 the CAD report that was not provided was not 10 responsive to their request. 11 In any event, the Circuit Court felt 12 that because it is possible that that particular 13 incident was not fully fleshed out at an 14 evidentiary hearing before this body, that he 15 prohibited the Common Council from acting on the 16 recommendation and instructed this committee to 17 hear evidence as only to one item. That one item 18 that was - - had to do with the - - the missing 19 CAD report, if you will, was regarding a 20 September 6, 2010 event. In the committee's 21 report of its findings of fact it is labeled as 22 paragraph 5A. On the police report that was 23 heard at the committee it was item 21. Today's 24 hearing is only about that incident. 25 I have asked that - - that - - that All 00004 1 - - Or excuse me - - that Sergeant Reden read 2 into the record just to refresh the committee's 3 recollection as to item 21 only, and that it 4 seems to me, I would advise the committee to 5 allow the license applicant, through counsel, to 6 - - to add whatever evidence it wants the body to 7 consider in relation to its report. 8 ALDERWOMAN COGGS: Mr. Chairman. 9 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Alderwoman Coggs. 10 ALDERWOMAN COGGS: For the City 11 Attorney. So our decision today can only be 12 based on that one item? 13 MR. STEPHENS: That is all that the 14 court remanded back, was the one - - the 15 discussion on and the consideration of this one 16 event item. 17 CHAIRMAN BOHL: If I may clarify. It 18 is the totality of the decision that was rendered 19 before, which includes the police report. This 20 should be - - This one police report item 21 21 should be reconsidered, given any additional 22 discussion including this police report. It's 23 not - - Our decision isn't made solely on item 24 21. It was based on the decision that was 25 rendered at committee last time with any new 00005 1 evidence submitted relating to this police 2 report. 3 MR. STEPHENS: Correct. So at the 4 conclusion of this hearing the committee may 5 decide to keep paragraph 5A of its report the 6 same. It could choose to totally ignore it and 7 get rid of it, or modify it in whatever way it 8 sees fit. This is an opportunity for the 9 applicant to give you more information regarding 10 this one particular event. 11 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Mr. Chair. 12 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Alderman Kovac. 13 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Could you read 14 paragraph 5A to us, please? 15 MR. STEPHENS: Well, paragraph 5A 16 mimics item 21 of the police report, because item 17 21, pursuant to the motion, was adopted as a 18 finding of fact. 19 ALDERMAN KOVAC: So can we read that, 20 if we have it? 21 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Yeah, let me just - - I 22 just want to before we - - we have the Sergeant - 23 - before the reading the police report item, any 24 concerns with what was outlined here by - - by 25 Assistant City Attorney Adam Stephens. 00006 1 MR. LERNER: Do you want me to state my 2 appearance? 3 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Why don't you state 4 your appearance here first off. 5 MR. LERNER: Maistelman & Associates, 6 Attorney Matthew Lerner on behalf of Pop 7 Promotions, LLC, d/b/a, Texture Nightclub, who 8 also appears by Donato Salvo, who is in person. 9 CHAIRMAN BOHL: And I will just ask for 10 the record here for the applicant - - Why don't 11 we - - we have you sworn in here, if you would 12 raise your right hand? 13 (Whereupon the Applicant was sworn.) 14 CHAIRMAN BOHL: For the applicant, if 15 we could, name and address for the record, 16 please. 17 THE APPLICANT: Donato Salvo, 606 South 18 5th Street, Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53204. 19 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Mr. Lerner? 20 MR. LERNER: There are a few things I 21 would like to add, Mr. Chair. The first is, I'm 22 going to reincorporate all of the objections that 23 we made in the prior hearing. I realize that 24 you're probably going to just deny those. But 25 just for the record, I wanted to put those in. 00007 1 The other piece of information that I 2 think the committee should be aware of here is 3 that I, for the most part, agree with what the 4 City Attorney stated as to what Judge Moroney 5 ruled last week. However, the notice for this 6 hearing, in my reading at least, doesn't limit 7 these proceedings to just September 6th. So I - 8 - I think the committee should give us a little 9 leeway here, but certainly I - - I would have 10 expected the - - the notice would have been 11 limited more than it was, but it's not. In fact, 12 I believe it's the same exact notice that was 13 issued the last time. 14 CHAIRMAN BOHL: I will - - I appreciate 15 your request here. If - - if that is a formal 16 request of the body, I will actually note your 17 - - your desire to do so, or note your objection 18 to the fact that I will deny that, based upon the 19 fact that we have provided a proper due process 20 hearing and short of the - - the traditional 21 remanding of this based upon the one single item 22 that we will proceed forward, with any submission 23 of that particular single item and allowing you 24 any cross-examination and any testimony relating 25 to that item to be included. 00008 1 MR. LERNER: And a few other 2 preliminary items. To the extent that Mr. 3 Stephens also explained to the committee that you 4 could decide to strike item 5A at the end of this 5 hearing. I believe, based upon the ruling, and 6 again, I think Mr. Stephens would probably 7 confirm this. Because you are making a decision 8 based upon the evidence presented today in 9 combination with the evidence that was presented 10 at the last hearing, this body is free to make 11 any decision that it wants. And if that means 12 striking other items, you could strike other 13 items. I just want to make that clear for the 14 record, and I think, again, Mr. Stephens would 15 probably agree with that. 16 MR. STEPHENS: I would think that if 17 the committee - - if - - Depending on how the 18 committee considered the evidence that's offered 19 tonight, that it could in its wisdom change its 20 recommendation. So it's not bound by the earlier 21 recommendation. Certainly you could choose to do 22 any of - - of the possibilities in terms of 23 renewal, non-renewal, or renewal with a 24 suspension between ten and 90 days, depending on 25 how the facts come out today. 00009 1 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Again, it - - I would 2 request a motion that would clarify what 3 evidence, if there is a desire for sanction, 4 would be included. 5 MR. STEPHENS: Well, the findings of 6 fact report will not change. 7 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Other - - Other than 8 any report on this. 9 MR. STEPHENS: The - - The only thing 10 that will change is paragraph 5A. 11 MR. LERNER: I would - - 12 CHAIRMAN BOHL: You're going to 13 respectfully disagree here. 14 MR. LERNER: I would respectfully 15 disagree, because I think this body can - - you 16 know, anybody on this committee has had further 17 reflection since a couple weeks ago. There is no 18 reason why they couldn't say, you know what, I've 19 thought about this some more. I don't agree with 20 what I did last time. 21 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Why don't - - Why don't 22 - - I'm just going to say, why don't we cross 23 that bridge if there is a motion they're - - 24 they're going to make, okay. 25 ALDERMAN WITKOWIAK: Well, Mr. 00010 1 Chairman. If that were the case, then why 2 wouldn't everybody else come and testify. 3 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Right. Right. 4 ALDERMAN WITKOWIAK: If that were the 5 case. 6 MR. LERNER: But I think the bottom 7 line, Mr. Chair, is that you, as the - - as the 8 body here get to decide what you want to do with 9 the evidence in its totality. So I think in its 10 totality, if - - if you, as the committee, decide 11 you want to do something different from last 12 time, you have the right to do that, because 13 you've already heard all the testimony from last 14 time. I mean, I think I would treat this as if 15 it's been one - - one complete proceeding rather 16 than two. And I think that was the intention of 17 the court. 18 CHAIRMAN BOHL: All right. I think 19 we're - - I think we're fine with that, I hope. 20 Why don't we go ahead and we'll - - we'll ask you 21 to proceed then with the reading of - - of the 22 item, police report number 21 and 5A in the 23 findings of fact. 24 SERGEANT REDEN: Item 21. On 9/6 of 25 2010 at 1:58 a.m. Milwaukee Police observed a 00011 1 large crowd gathering in the street in front of 2 Textures Nightclub located at 606 South 5th 3 Street. Security officers were flagging down 4 police to report that subjects were attempting to 5 fight with security, and making threats to shoot 6 up the place. 7 Officers called for more squads to the 8 scene. Police were advised that two security 9 officers had deployed pepper spray at the three 10 subjects who were disorderly. Police were told 11 that the three subjects were inside the club 12 refusing to leave, and when verbal attempts 13 failed to have the subjects leave, security 14 attempted to physically remove - - remove them. 15 Once they got the subjects to the door, threats 16 were made to security, and one subject was 17 overheard stating he had a gun in his car. A 18 fight between the subjects and security, and that 19 is when a security guard utilized the pepper 20 spray. Citations were issued to the subjects for 21 disorderly conduct. 22 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Thank you. All right. 23 Mr. Lerner, I'll turn it over to you in terms of 24 the submission of any additional commentary or 25 anything else you want to elicit out, based upon 00012 1 the additional police - - police CAD report that 2 was provided here. 3 MR. LERNER: I'm going to start out by 4 calling Brian. Do you want the witnesses to sit 5 at the table or at the mic? 6 CHAIRMAN BOHL: That's fine. 7 MR. LERNER: Would you state your name 8 for the record? 9 THE WITNESS: Brian Davis. 10 MR. LERNER: And could you describe 11 your occupation? 12 THE WITNESS: I'm outside security 13 protection at the nightclub. 14 MR. LERNER: And what sort of 15 experience and training do you have? 16 THE WITNESS: In the security field? 17 MR. LERNER: Yes. 18 THE WITNESS: I've been doing it for a 19 couple years. Prior to this, I was military 20 police. 21 MR. LERNER: Okay. And you obviously 22 heard we're - - we're here to talk about what 23 happened on September 6th. Can you tell me what 24 you witnessed on that night? 25 THE WITNESS: Overall it was a pretty 00013 1 calm night. I don't remember anything out of the 2 ordinary, other than at the end of the night the 3 bar then closed. They had two people inside who 4 refused to leave. At that point the bouncers 5 were instructed to try to get them out. At that 6 point they could not. They came out to get me, 7 and we got them out into the street. 8 MR. LERNER: And what - - 9 THE WITNESS: Sorry. 10 MR. LERNER: And what happened once you 11 got them into the street? 12 THE WITNESS: We hadn't made it to the 13 street yet. At the point that we were getting 14 them out of the door, one of the males made a 15 comment that they had a gun. So at that point it 16 was decided by me to use pepper spray to de- 17 escalate the situation. 18 MR. LERNER: Okay. And did any of the 19 individuals actually have a gun? 20 THE WITNESS: I don't believe one was 21 found on them. We're not too sure of that. 22 MR. LERNER: Okay. Are you aware if 23 there was a search of the vehicle that they were 24 in? 25 THE WITNESS: Once again, I'm not sure. 00014 1 That's something Milwaukee would have done. 2 MR. LERNER: Okay. And if you had to 3 describe how your security team responded to that 4 particular incident, would you say that it was an 5 appropriate response? It was something that you 6 had trained for? 7 THE WITNESS: Absolutely. 8 MR. LERNER: Okay. Anything else you 9 want to add? 10 THE WITNESS: On the night in question 11 or just in general? 12 MR. LERNER: Either/or. 13 THE WITNESS: All right. I - - I'm on 14 the spot now literally, myself, there. I am 15 there every night and have been for a good 15 or 16 16 months. There is not one day - - Well, excuse 17 me - - with the exception of one day, have I not 18 been there, in all this course of time. And 19 that's the normal, you know, operating business 20 week for them from when they open to when they 21 close is when I leave. I - - I walk around the 22 block, you know, literally four or five times 23 myself, personally, to observe things, make sure 24 there is no, you know, a fray on the corner, 25 whether it be opposing to the club - - 00015 1 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Thank you. Thank you 2 for your testimony. I don't believe the court 3 said that we can allow individuals, that we are 4 obligated to allow individuals to have additional 5 rehearing. I think that he addressed items 6 relating to what was obligated here. 7 MR. LERNER: Okay. 8 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Questions by committee? 9 Committee, first? Mr. Stephens, you had 10 something. 11 MR. STEPHENS: Yes, just briefly. Sir, 12 you indicated that you - - you chose to de- 13 escalates the situation by using pepper spray. 14 Can you explain to the committee how that de- 15 escalated the situation? 16 THE WITNESS: At that point, if somebody 17 were to go for a gun, they would not be able to 18 visibly see to physically, you know, I guess, 19 target acquisition, you know. I - - They would 20 not be an active shooter at that point, or it 21 would lessen the possibility of that being if 22 there was a gun brought up. 23 MR. STEPHENS: Did you have reason to 24 believe that that person was armed at the time? 25 THE WITNESS: Other than their 00016 1 statements, no. I - - None that I'm - - I - - I 2 wasn't aware that they were armed, no. Other 3 than the fact that, you know, but that's 4 something I hear normally. 5 MR. STEPHENS: What? That - - 6 THE WITNESS: That people have guns. I 7 mean, that's nothing new for me. 8 MR. STEPHENS: Inside the club or - - 9 THE WITNESS: No. Not - - Not inside 10 the club. Just, you know, walking down the 11 street or - - or passing the club or - - or maybe 12 not even necessarily in front of the club, just, 13 you know, people talk loud and, you know, if 14 you're on the spot, you hear it. 15 MR. STEPHENS: Thank you, Mr. Chair. 16 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Mr. Chair. 17 So how - - How often have you heard 18 people say they have a gun? 19 THE WITNESS: Oh, it's, I mean, less 20 than a handful of times. I mean, I don't - - 21 ALDERMAN KOVAC: How often have you 22 used pepper spray? 23 THE WITNESS: Whenever necessary. 24 ALDERMAN KOVAC: So more than just this 25 one time? 00017 1 THE WITNESS: Yes, sir. 2 ALDERMAN KOVAC: How often? 3 THE WITNESS: Maybe once every two 4 months or so. I don't - - I think it's hard to 5 recall where you're, you know what I mean? 6 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Do you use it every 7 time you hear somebody say, gun? 8 THE WITNESS: No. Just this - - this 9 particular situation a van, you know, in the 10 process of getting them out of the building and 11 onto the street, their vehicle was a ride that 12 they had established. I don't know if they were 13 - - if they were with someone, whatever. A van 14 pulled up, and at that point a third male got out 15 of the van and threatened me physically. So I, 16 at that point, like I said, made a judgment call 17 to de-escalate the situation rather than have a 18 big fight start out of control. If they do have 19 anything, I would rather have called the 20 situation right then than have it spiral out of 21 control. That was a judgment call that I, 22 myself, made. 23 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Thank you. 24 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Are there other 25 questions by committee? No other questions by 00018 1 committee. All right. Mr. Lerner. 2 MR. LERNER: And have you actually seen 3 a gun on the premises? 4 THE WITNESS: I have not. 5 MR. LERNER: Okay. Thank you. 6 THE WITNESS: We actually physically 7 search people at the door. 8 MR. LERNER: Have you ever found one 9 during any of those searches? 10 THE WITNESS: Negative. 11 MR. LERNER: Okay. That's all I got. 12 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 13 ALDERMAN HAMILTON: Mr. Chair. I have 14 one more question. 15 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Alderman Hamilton? 16 ALDERMAN HAMILTON: You - - Your 17 surveillance or patrol around the - - the club 18 goes how far? 19 THE WITNESS: I go - - Literally I will 20 go from - - I'll go from 6th Street, anywhere 21 that there is an available parking spot for 22 anybody to come to our particular location, I 23 will pretty much walk as much as I can. 24 Obviously, I have to - - I have 15 different jobs 25 to do at once. But I physically patrol the block 00019 1 on 5th or one of my guys is in a squad car 2 driving around. The question, how far do we go? 3 I - - I would say that we go from 4th Street and 4 Pierce all the way over to Virginia and back up 5 to 6th Street within the same perimeters, about, 6 between 4th and 6th and Virginia and Pierce. 7 ALDERMAN HAMILTON: And have you had to 8 diffuse situations outside of the - - the front 9 of the establishment around that perimeter that 10 you - - 11 THE WITNESS: Yeah, I have, but it's 12 not - - My own personal opinion is there's a lot 13 of bars around that situation. So, you know, 14 being that you have such a - - a large amount of 15 bars in such a small area, a lot of people park 16 wherever they can and walk to their particular 17 venue. So, yes, I have been involved in stuff 18 that does - - does not directly relate to us, and 19 - - and, yes, there has been involvement, but I 20 would not say every time that it's us by any 21 means. It's just - - 22 ALDERMAN HAMILTON: All right. Mr. 23 Chair, I - - I guess I want to tread lightly with 24 the - - with some of my questioning, because I 25 guess I want to - - One of the issues I wanted to 00020 1 get close to was - - may be connected to another 2 item. So if we - - 3 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Alderman, I prefer not 4 to do that. And I'll say why. Because I denied 5 the request made by Mr. Lerner to open this up. 6 He wished to - - to bring other things forward. 7 This literally, when it was specifically sent 8 back by the courts, identified this one specific 9 CAD report and said very limited they had the 10 ability to raise that issue. Otherwise, I - - I 11 think that it starts to open us up to say, okay, 12 now if we want to start going in other areas, that 13 it's harder for us to deny him going in other 14 areas. 15 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Mr. Chair, and I just 16 want - - 17 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Alderman Kovac, please. 18 ALDERMAN KOVAC: I just want to make it 19 clear. And maybe Mr. Stephens can answer this 20 question, but the reason this particular item got 21 remanded back had to do with paperwork and 22 whether it was provided in a timely manner. Not 23 because there was anything necessarily 24 inaccurate. 25 MR. STEPHENS: Correct. It was - - 00021 1 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Get them the proper 2 paperwork and get the CAD report they asked for 3 on time. 4 MR. STEPHENS: They - - Right. They 5 asked for paperwork which they thought was 6 necessary to pursue their case properly. They 7 didn't have that paperwork. So the court said 8 you get another shot at it, because in order to 9 have a full hearing on the matter you needed to 10 have all the paperwork. They now have all the 11 paperwork, and that's what we're doing tonight, 12 giving them an opportunity. 13 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Mr. Chair. 14 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Mr. Stephens, did not 15 the - - did not that particular decision specify 16 that what was being sent back was specific to the 17 - - 18 MR. STEPHENS: On this one item. On 19 this one item only, correct. 20 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Yes. That's what I 21 wanted to get after and clarify. 22 ALDERMAN KOVAC: So the court didn't 23 adjust the merits of the whole decision. They 24 just wanted to give them the facts - - 25 CHAIRMAN BOHL: No. 00022 1 ALDERMAN KOVAC: - - on one item get 2 them the paperwork. They now have it. 3 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Right. Like I said, I 4 really want to tread lightly in terms of opening 5 other things up. Mr. Lerner. 6 MR. LERNER: Just to - - Two things. 7 I, again, want to reiterate what the notice says. 8 And the notice is unlimited, and I understand you 9 already made a ruling on that. However, I also 10 want to make clear, so the committee understands, 11 that the lawsuit that we filed was a public 12 records action. It was not a 125-12 judicial 13 review. It was solely a public record action, 14 and - - and this is what the judge decided to do. 15 Also, for the record, we also - - There is also 16 still some dispute or question from our end as to 17 whether we have all the documents. Now, the one 18 - - the one CAD report that was missing, we did 19 get that. But there are four incident reports 20 which we believe are missing. They may still be 21 missing. The City says they don't exist. But we 22 still need to finish out those issues. Just so 23 the committee knows what exactly the litigation 24 was about, or is about. 25 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Okay. Thank you. All 00023 1 right. Were there any other questions that the 2 committee members have of this witness at this 3 time? Thank you. 4 And at this time here I will 5 have Alderman Zielinski make pages 271 and 272 of 6 our E-book, which relates to two pages of a 7 police CAD report, for call number 102490191, a 8 document that was created on 9/6 of 2010 part of 9 our official record in this proceeding. Are 10 there any objections to that? Hearing none, so 11 ordered. 12 Mr. Lerner, was there anyone else you 13 wanted to call relating to this particular - - 14 MR. LERNER: Yes, Police Officer 15 Monette. And then I just have one more witness 16 after. 17 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Officer, you've been 18 sworn in here. Could you provide, please, your 19 name and your position within the department? 20 OFFICER MONETTE: Robert Monette. I'm 21 a police officer with the Milwaukee Police 22 Department. District 2, late shift. 23 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Thank you. If you 24 could speak up a little bit, thank you, Officer 25 Monette. Mr. Lerner. 00024 1 THE WITNESS: Do you need me to - - 2 MR. LERNER: What's that? 3 THE WITNESS: I was going to ask you if 4 you needed me to repeat anything. 5 MR. LERNER: No. Okay. Officer 6 Monette, are you familiar with the September 6, 7 2010 incident for which you were the author of 8 the PA-33? 9 THE WITNESS: Yes, I am. 10 MR. LERNER: And you heard what was 11 testified to a few minutes ago by Mr. Davis, who 12 is security for Texture. In the PA-33 it states: 13 "It should be noted that the subject's vehicle 14 was searched with consent and no weapons were 15 located." 16 THE WITNESS: Correct. 17 MR. LERNER: That's an accurate 18 statement? 19 THE WITNESS: That is an accurate 20 statement. 21 MR. LERNER: So when you were on scene 22 that night, you, I'm guessing, not only searched 23 the vehicle, but you also searched the 24 individuals - - 25 THE WITNESS: Absolutely, three people 00025 1 were taken into custody, - - 2 MR. LERNER: Okay. 3 THE WITNESS: - - issued disorderly 4 conduct citations, and custodially searched. 5 MR. LERNER: And there were - - 6 THE WITNESS: No weapons found. 7 MR. LERNER: - - no weapons of any 8 kind. No guns, no knives. 9 THE WITNESS: No. 10 MR. LERNER: Okay. Could you describe 11 for me what your thoughts are about - - Or if you 12 believe that Texture's security acted 13 appropriately that night? 14 THE WITNESS: Absolutely. 15 MR. LERNER: Okay. 16 THE WITNESS: Texture's security is 17 very professional. We have a good working 18 rapport with them, and they do their best to 19 handle the crowd at leaving time in an orderly 20 fashion with minimal requests for police service. 21 Unfortunately, there is a number of people that 22 come out at the same time from all the clubs on 23 the block. Police presence is generally 24 required. 25 MR. LERNER: And when you say because 00026 1 of all the people that come out on the block at 2 the same time, you're referring to all of the 3 taverns in the area, not just because of Texture. 4 THE WITNESS: Correct. 5 MR. LERNER: So patrols would be there, 6 regardless if it was just Texture that was open, 7 or if it was every place else. 8 THE WITNESS: Correct. 9 MR. LERNER: All right. 10 THE WITNESS: A little bit of clarity 11 on that though is most of the clubs on 5th Street 12 close at different times. So we know that we 13 need to be at Texture about half an hour before 14 bar close, and know we need to be at Envy about 15 15 minutes before bar close, and then the smaller 16 clubs in the area generally close a little bit 17 after Envy starts letting out. So there is not a 18 flood of everyone from all the clubs at the exact 19 same time. 20 MR. LERNER: And when you're on patrol 21 in the area, are you just on 5th Street or you're 22 on all the other streets where all the bars are, 23 as well. 24 THE WITNESS: Normally the way that I 25 work it when I'm working is I will put myself out 00027 1 at Texture, monitoring Texture close at 606 South 2 5th Street. 3 MR. LERNER: Okay. 4 THE WITNESS: Then we'll move down the 5 street, and we will change our location to 6 whichever tavern we're actually watching the 7 crowd come out of. 8 MR. LERNER: Right. And as you 9 described before, where you are located is purely 10 based upon who is letting out. It's not 11 necessarily representative of who is causing a 12 problem. 13 THE WITNESS: Correct. 14 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Mr. Lerner, if you want 15 to hone your questions to this officer based upon 16 the police report or the CAD dispatch report, I 17 would appreciate that. 18 MR. LERNER: No further questions. 19 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Thank you. Questions 20 by committee for this officer? Thank you, 21 Officer. He is here because of my signature 22 here, and you no longer need him here. Correct? 23 MR. LERNER: He can take off. 24 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Thank you. Thank you, 25 Officer. 00028 1 MR. LERNER: Thank you, Officer. Thank 2 you, Chairman, for issuing the subpoena. 3 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Did you have one last 4 witness to call forward here? 5 MR. LERNER: Yes. Police Officer 6 Agnew, who is also here pursuant to subpoena, the 7 Chair's subpoena. 8 OFFICER AGNEW: Police Officer 9 Christopher Agnew, District 2 power shift. 10 MR. LERNER: Officer Agnew, you have 11 heard the testimony of Mr. Davis and Police 12 Officer Monette. Can you talk, also, a little 13 bit about your patrols and specifically, if you 14 want to, the patrol of September 6th, if you 15 recall? 16 THE WITNESS: I do not recall being 17 there that night. I know I'm on the CAD, but I 18 believe I was off. I believe I called in sick 19 that day. 20 MR. LERNER: Okay. 21 THE WITNESS: But what I do is the same 22 thing as Officer Monette - - 23 ALDERMAN WITKOWIAK: Mr. Chairman. 24 CHAIRMAN BOHL: I'm going to ask that 25 the testimony be relegated to September 6th. 00029 1 THE WITNESS: Okay. Um - - 2 MR. LERNER: You said you were listed 3 on the CAD, but you don't think you were in that 4 night. Why don't you think you were in that 5 night, and why might you be listed on the CAD if 6 you weren't in? 7 THE WITNESS: I called in sick. And if 8 you look at the CAD, I believe there is four 9 people on that squad, and that - - that's 10 obviously not correct. 11 MR. LERNER: Okay. 12 THE WITNESS: I called in sick that 13 day. 14 MR. LERNER: Okay. No further 15 questions. 16 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Thank you. Any other 17 questions by committee of this officer? Thank 18 you. 19 SERGEANT REDEN: Mr. Chairman? Do you 20 want me to - - I kind of have an understanding of 21 communications as far as what happened with that. 22 Do you want - - Is it the committee's desire to 23 have that explained? 24 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Certainly. 25 SERGEANT REDEN: What happened - - 00030 1 CHAIRMAN BOHL: And - - And for - - for 2 our officers here, you - - you are no longer be 3 held to go here, so you're free to leave. Thank 4 you for your service here. Go ahead. 5 SERGEANT REDEN: What happens at the 6 start of the shift before they would know that 7 the officer called in sick, the dispatchers will 8 log-on the computers, and they'll take the 9 schedule for that shift before it's been updated, 10 and they'll put that information in there. And 11 when it changes, that computer still recognizes 12 that he's still assigned to it, even though 13 they've changed it and added a new officer, too. 14 That's why on that CAD report you'll see there's 15 three different people off, and three different 16 officers assigned to it. 17 CHAIRMAN BOHL: And that would be based 18 upon like a squad number that would be assigned, 19 typically from that area? 20 SERGEANT REDEN: Yes. They'll look at 21 that the - - the line-up for the day, which was 22 faxed to them from the district. When a Sergeant 23 first gets there, and that's before a lot of 24 times they get sick calls, they'll take that 25 information, automatically start to put it into 00031 1 the computer in the dispatch system, so they have 2 access to it. And then if there's changes, then 3 they'll make the changes, and that's when that 4 happens where they'll still recognize the first 5 person that's put in there. 6 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Thank you for 7 clarifying that. Any questions by committee? 8 Mr. Lerner, I'll allow you to provide any 9 additional summation here at this time here. 10 Then we'll hear - - Unless we want to hear - - 11 Alderman Witkowiak, were there any additional 12 comments that you wanted to make here before we 13 hear closing from Mr. Lerner? 14 ALDERMAN WITKOWIAK: You know, I'll 15 just say that this was a - - the reason that it 16 came back here, this was, at best, a 17 technicality. This area wasn't - - Now, from 18 what I understand there wasn't a contention from 19 the judge that there was something - - something 20 flawed about - - about what was remanded to him 21 through this request for the injunction or the 22 hearing. This was - - This was because it was a 23 - - a PA-33 missing from their attorneys - - 24 CHAIRMAN BOHL: It's actually a CAD. 25 ALDERMAN WITKOWIAK: A CAD. 00032 1 CHAIRMAN BOHL: A CAD, not a PA-33. 2 ALDERMAN WITKOWIAK: However, as I 3 understand, it was similar, if not, in fact, 4 identical to the - - the item on the police 5 report. So there is nothing - - There is nothing 6 substantial that has changed besides a piece of 7 paper - two sheets - these two sheets of paper 8 that weren't supplied with the initial request 9 are now supplied. I would - - I would ask the 10 committee to hold firm in their recommendations 11 of the previous meeting, based on nothing has 12 changed. Thank you. 13 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Mr. Lerner. 14 MR. LERNER: Thank you, Mr. Chair. 15 There are a couple of items that I think need to 16 be addressed here. At the last hearing there 17 were statements and concerns made about this 18 licensee operating without accountability. I can 19 tell you that that's absolutely not going to 20 happen. 21 ALDERMAN KOVAC: I thought we weren't 22 going to go outside of this item. 23 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Well, I will give him 24 just a little bit of leeway here, but I will ask 25 you try to tie this in here to this report and 00033 1 this - - 2 MR. LERNER: Back to what I was saying. 3 There were some concerns about this applicant 4 operating without accountability. And that's 5 absolutely not going to be the case. Mr. Salvo 6 and his business partners own and operate 7 numerous other businesses in the City that I 8 believe many of the committee members are 9 familiar with. Tutto's, Notte, the Comedy Cafe. 10 They have ties to the community. They have no 11 intention of leaving the area anytime soon. So 12 for them to operate with reckless abandon would 13 only lead to one thing, and that's customers who 14 don't feel safe, and a business that will not 15 succeed. 16 Last year they operated more 17 efficiently and more secured than they had the 18 year before. Last year when we were at the 19 committee, there were 13 items on the police 20 report. This year there were five. We believe 21 two of those items should have been struck. 22 All my clients wish to do is to 23 continue operating the tight ship that they have 24 been. And they want to end the establishment on 25 a positive note when their lease is up, and move 00034 1 on to their next venture. So I would ask the 2 committee to reconsider their previous decision, 3 and to renew my client's license. 4 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Thank you. 5 MR. LERNER: And thank you, Mr. Chair, 6 for allowing me some leeway on that. 7 ALDERMAN WITKOWIAK: Mr. Chairman. I'm 8 asking - - I'm asking the committee to protect my 9 constituents, not their customers. 10 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Well, I - - I got a 11 direct question. The only - - Which I think I 12 was hoping you would actually address September 13 6th, at least pretend to, in your remarks. You 14 did not have the benefit, and the judge declared 15 that you - - we all had to be here for another 16 extra hour, and the police had to wait five 17 hours, so that you could read over a CAD report 18 on a PA-33. Was there anything in that CAD 19 report that you want us to know that would change 20 our opinion of what the PA-33 said? 21 MR. LERNER: Nothing in particular on 22 the report, no. 23 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Okay. Then I'll make 24 the same motion I made last time for the same 25 reasons. 00035 1 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Okay. All right. The 2 motion, and please correct me if I - - I don't 3 state this - - from my memory. I don't have it 4 before me. Motion by Alderman Kovac - - 5 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Well, you - - 6 CHAIRMAN BOHL: No. I know. I want to 7 say it for the proper reasons. I don't have the 8 numbers because no police report was provided to 9 me. So is there a hard copy of the police 10 report? 11 MR. STEPHENS: We - - We do, Alderman, 12 but the cleanest way of doing this is to simply 13 say that the analysis that was reached at the 14 last hearing, when you created the findings of 15 fact when the motion was issued, are adopted. 16 There is not any significant change based on this 17 hearing to item 5A. So, therefore, the committee 18 report, as it was drafted the last time - - 19 MR. LERNER: I think that's actually 20 for the committee to decide, yeah. 21 MR. STEPHENS: Well, that's what the 22 motion is, what I'm hearing. And - - And I'm 23 assisting the Chair in terms of articulating what 24 actually that motion is, which is the same motion 25 that was issued last time. Which, therefore, 00036 1 would result in the exact same committee report 2 of its findings of fact and conclusions of law. 3 ALDERMAN KOVAC: I don't think we need 4 to articulate now. It's all in the record from 5 last time. 6 MR. STEPHENS: As long as nothing has 7 changed, then there's nothing new to articulate. 8 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Right, that's - - 9 Counsel, if anything's changed, then actually 10 nothing changed, so. 11 MR. LERNER: Well, that wasn't the 12 question I was - - that was asked, if the CAD - - 13 CHAIRMAN BOHL: We're - - We're in 14 committee on the matter here. There's been a 15 motion made. Do we have a police report? 16 Please. The motion made by - - The motion made 17 by Alderman Kovac, and there will be a finding - 18 - And, Alderman Kovac, please clarify this if I 19 am not correct, Alderman Kovac? 20 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Yes. 21 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Please clarify this if 22 I am not correct. Okay. The motion that will be 23 made is that the findings that have been - - that 24 were provided at the last meeting are to stand, 25 and that no additional changes should be granted 00037 1 based upon the additional evidence that was 2 submitted to the committee. That would be a 3 motion for non-renewal, and it was based upon the 4 items in the police report. I believe that those 5 items would have been item number 21 through 25, 6 and it was additional testimony provided by one 7 additional witness as well as some police - - 8 additional testimony of police officers 9 responding to the area. Is that correct? 10 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Yes. 11 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Is there any discussion 12 on the motion? And my only discussion is I raise 13 the issue regarding evidence before and in terms 14 of the motion, and that would be my reason for 15 objecting to it here now, to be consistent. Can 16 we just get a roll call vote? Is there any other 17 discussion? Can we get a roll call vote on the 18 motion for non-renewal at this time? 19 STAFF ASSISTANT LEE: Alderman Hamilton? 20 ALDERMAN HAMILTON: Aye. 21 STAFF ASSISTANT LEE: Kovac? 22 ALDERMAN KOVAC: Aye. 23 STAFF ASSISTANT LEE: Coggs? 24 ALDERWOMAN COGGS: Objection. 25 CHAIRMAN BOHL: That would be no. 00038 1 STAFF ASSISTANT LEE: Zielinski? 2 ALDERMAN ZIELINSKI: Aye. 3 STAFF ASSISTANT LEE: Mr. Chair? 4 CHAIRMAN BOHL: No. The motion will 5 again carry on a three to two vote. Mr. 6 Stephens, we will again turn this over to you. 7 MR. STEPHENS: The committee will be 8 doing - - The committee has done a report of its 9 findings of fact and conclusions of law, 10 recommending to the Milwaukee Common Council that 11 your license be non-renewed. You will receive 12 another newer amended version of that, although 13 it will be reading identical, other than the - - 14 a new vote. You will have an opportunity to file 15 written exceptions to that report. If you do, 16 they must be received by the City Clerk by July 17 20, 2011 by 4:45 p.m. If you submit written 18 objections, you will also have the opportunity to 19 appear before the Milwaukee Common Council when 20 it considers this matter on July 26, 2011 in the 21 Common Council Chambers. Please be advised that 22 this report is a recommendation to full Common 23 Council. The Common Council makes the final 24 decision whether your license is renewed with a 25 suspension between ten and 90 days or non- 00039 1 renewed. Do you understand that? 2 MR. LERNER: Yes. 3 MR. STEPHENS: And, Mr. Lerner, you 4 will accept service. 5 MR. LERNER: Yes. 6 MR. STEPHENS: Thank you. 7 CHAIRMAN BOHL: Thank you. 8 (Proceedings ended.) 9 * * * * * 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 00040 1 2 3 STATE OF WISCONSIN ) 4 ) 5 MILWAUKEE COUNTY ) 6 7 I, JEAN M. BARINA, of Milwaukee Reporters 8 Associated, Inc., 5124 West Blue Mound Road, 9 Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53208, certify that the 10 foregoing proceedings is a full and complete 11 transcript of TEXTURE taken before the Licenses 12 Committee on 7/11/2011. 13 14 15 16 17 18 JEAN M. BARINA 19 Court Reporter 20 21 22 Dated this day of July, 2011. 23 24